going to look like, that's the cool thing. >> reporter: and become real life dr. doolittle, for the deep. nbc news. >> the beautiful giants of the sea to take us off the air tonight, on that note i wish you a good night, catch the katie phang show at 12 pm eastern on nbc, from across the networks of nbc news, thank you for staying up late, see you at the end of tomorrow. tomorrow. tonight. >> this was what i call a nuts and slots defense. >> donald trump's attorneys i can shame stormy daniels. >> she wants the jury to think stormy daniels is a liar, and

she's crazy. and she also wants the jurors to judge her for her occupation. >> the people's witness apparently holds her own. >> she said, if i was going to make this up, i would've made it a much better story. >> tonight, the cross- examination of the woman at the center of the cover-up trump's denial of the fair hurt his defense. >> the denial puts the jury in the position of trying to choose who they believe. >> the relics i cause the defendant to storm off. >> i'm not supposed to be here. we are so innocent. is a sitting republican senator help skirt the judge's gag order? >> this is a bunch of democrats saying, we want to make sure that donald trump cannot talk. >> all in starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes.. the manhattan election interference trial rolled on today. there were some fireworks and

there was a lot of mudslinging. some of it even came outside the courtroom, not from trump, but from another florida man. united states republican senator rick scott. a real live senator missing votes to be there. we will have more and what he was doing there and what he said later in the show. inside the courtroom, as stormy daniels finished her second and final day of testimony with three hours of grueling cross examination, trump slurs put most of their energy into painting her essay liar, gold digger, and worst of all is for the defendant, a trump heater. for most of those three hours, susan necheles grilled daniels about every source of every penny she made from strip club tours to tv shows to candles. yes, candles, that portray the adult film star as patron at one point she asked, you were selling yourself to people who hated former president trump is someone who would get trump indicted, right? >> she replied, was now selling myself to anyone.

i feel duty bound to stop here for a second. you know who was selling themselves this week? you will never guess. >> for the first time, we are creating a physical trump card. purchase 47 digital cards, and we will mail you a beautiful trading card that's an authentic piece of the pseudo- tour when i took that now famous mug shot and it was a great sue. believe me. a really good suit. it is cut up and you will get a piece of it. i will autograph some of them. a true collectors item. something to give to your family and kids and children -- grandchildren. you will also be invited to join me for a gala dinner at my beautiful mar-a-lago. >> you've got to get 47 cards, and virtual ones, physical one that has a little bit of a dice step piece of the soup. like a tiny part of the shroud of turin and you get to walk

around with. that dinner that he was hawking a 47 of his digital trading cards was held at mar-a-lago last night on the off day. of course. he's he used similar schemes to promote a sneaker line, brenda perfume and cologne and a pricey copy of the by -- bible. stormy daniels according to trump slurs are trying to trade on her brand and they argued today she was untrustworthy for defaulting the story of her affair with trump even after being paid up in signing a nondisclosure agreement asking her, even though you had agreed you would not discuss the supposed recommend you receive a lot of money for that agreement, you decided you wanted to publicly see you at sex with former president trump, right? >> no. nobody would ever want to publicly say that. she added, wanted to publicly defend myself after people attacking me after michael cohen

told about the story. trump's attorneys i should know failed to mention the by the time dennis did speak out about the affair, ted already been reported to the public by the wall street journal. the trump legal team for obvious reasons didn't get the details about the sexual encounter between daniels and her claim because they were still suggesting it never happened. they did talk about daniels sex work implying it made her less credible. after listing her credits, they said, quote, you have a lot of experience making phony stories about sex to which daniels responded, that somehow i would put it. the sex in the films is very much real, just like what happened to me in that room. she tried again saying, now there's a story you are telling about president trump? daniels replied, that was untrue, i would've written it to be a lot better. cross-examination when it was over, prosecutor walked daniels back through the facts and redirect and ask, on balance, has your publicly telling the truth about mr. trump been net

positive or net negative for your life? daniels replied with a single word, negative. after daniels left the stand, jurors heard from two archival witnesses to renew evidence into the record including an executive from harpercollins, published trump's how to book think big, make it happen in business and life. she read several excerpts including the telling one, quote, i just can't stomach disloyalty. i put the people who are loyal to me on a high pedestal and take care them very well. talking about someone from the past to disappointed him, this woman was very disloyal, now i go out of my way to make her life miserable. he had a, my motto is, always get even. when somebody screws you, screw them back in spades. that's great writing is a neck? after witnesses were done today, trump's lawyers moved again for a mistrial saying stormy daniels testimony was inconsistent and prejudicial that the case could not stand.

judge merchan said once again that if the defense didn't like up, they should've objected more during her testimony. that did not sit well with the defendant who could barely wait until he was out of the courtroom to sound off. >> i don't think we have to do any explaining. i'm not allowed to because this judge is corrupt. he is a corrupt judge. this judge, what he did, what his ruling was was a disgrace. he is a corrupt judge and his totally conflicted. i got to get back on the campaign trail. i'm not supposed to be here. we are so innocent. there's never been anything like it. >> the campaign trail like dinners at mar-a-lago. judge merchan rejected a request from trump slurs to ease his day-glo ordered so he could respond in public to stormy daniels testimony. joining me, two people at the courthouse today. legal correspondent lisa rubin, former deputy -- harry litman, great to have you here.

three different things happen today. stormy daniels cross and redirect. the sort of hearing about the mistrial which was interesting. the last witness who got sworn in and will be continuing tomorrow. let's start with stormy daniels. we had around the stand when i talk to you on tuesday. cross today, how did it go? >> for whom is the question? i think it went really well for the prosecution. i do. the reason is because while there are small differences in stormy daniels story, this was an event that happened in 2006. it's 2024. the fact that susan necheles went on, i counted, first seven pages about whether stormy daniels was consistent are not about saying whether or not they had dinner, is beside the point. they were nibbling at the margins. at the same time, making her more sympathetic by attacking

her for things that were either socially regressive or the same sort of things their own client does. for example, as you said, selling himself. stormy daniels was selling merchandise. donald trump sells merchandise all the time in addition to his entities and shreds of his suits, he selling gold sneakers, he selling bibles. stormy daniels has a t-shirt that says team daniels. and they asked what that means. she said anybody who hates donald trump? she said anybody who is basically on my side. the way in which they try to shame her and exploit minor inconsistencies in her story over a period of years, i thought backfired on them. if anything, it made her seem all the more determined and resolute in the details of her story. >> you were saying she was a compelling witness and you weren't sure what the jury made of her because her presentation and her line of work will be

fairly new to most people. i don't know. in terms of what she does for a living. you were trying to model what the jury was thinking what is your thinking after watching today? >> i basically agree with lisa. trent 40 fans a few jabs. she didn't come close. as a matter of technique, she did a lot -- shoes should a couple of the. isn't it a fact? daniels coolly said false, et cetera. that stopped her in her tracks. this misstep of suggesting, if you work in adult films, you couldn't be cowed by a 60-year- old billionaire looming over you. i think that was a false note that was offensive. in general, i've got to say, i thought cross-examination, you must control.

you want the jury looking at you. if anything, storm he was the dynamic in the room and you could see it from home the jury was looking at. >> they should be the wall you're hitting the ball. you have it. controlling where the ball goes. >> and your controlling the pace. i agree with harry, she was not only a controlling witness but the rare witnesses better on cross-examination than on direct. and direct, she meander. she had her own objective. she wanted to tell her truth that doesn't fit neatly into judge merchan's rules. >> the point you made, you said earlier that the nuts and which i famous line when he was attacking anita hill. an attempt to be like this when she came forward with allegations against clarence thomas. this woman cannot be trusted. he wrote the famous line.

just to both the content or that. here is susan necheles talking to stormy daniels. i want to get your reaction. you've had sex and under 200 movies. and there are naked men and naked women it having sex including yourself. according to you, seeing a man sitting on a bed and a t-shirt on backer shares, it was upsetting you got lightheaded and -- yes, when you're not expecting a man twice your age to be in their underwear, i've seen my husband naked almost every day. if i came out of the bathroom and it was not my husband and it was mr. trump on the bed, i probably have the same reaction. what did you think of this line of inquiry which is you are a porn star and you're upset about a man trying to have sex with you? >> it's you are a porn star, how do you think you have the right to have consent ? because of what you do for your line of

work, you must have a sign around your neck that basically says open to all. stormy daniels is clear, in my do the for a living but i choose when i do it for a living and how and when. not to do it with a 60-year-old man who i found repugnant into was looming over me in a way that felt like imbalance of power that i was not into. >> when talking about that susan necheles is conceding that she's got to make it seem the whole thing is fantasy. they never had sex at all but she's asking about details of what she said and didn't say. it was scattershot and she -- she received what happens when you lead with your chin. >> this was one more thing. this relates to the hearing. which was the motion to dismiss. motion to dismiss on tuesday and it was this -- tonight. this motion to dismiss was wildly prejudicial.

it was outside the bounds. my understanding of that is part of the defense -- part of the ruling by judge merchan that it stays in because you said it did not happen. i want to come to that but first, this is from the first day, but the line of questioning which is this is your career for over 20 years. writing and directing? you have a lot of experience in making phony stories about sex? the sex in the films is real just like what happened to me in that room. you're making stories for sex, you write these. daniels, no the sex is real. that's why it's pornography. that such a funny line. >> what i can tell you was that was not funny. that happened today. what i got out of that is the phrase what happened to me. she allowed her, again, to control the narrative and make

it about, this is something traumatic that happened to me. not this thing i participated in willingly. i thought that was impactful. the turn of phrase there, just like what happened to me in that room. >> when we get to the mistrial, how does that physically happen? is it sidebar? >> first of all, in an average trial two or three things happens and i think today was five or six. that was one of them. argument at the end of the day would be low key. judge merchan, eviscerated them both of them. i think that's why trump was upset. the jury left and they had an hour. >> stop right there. it's a perfect place. stick around. we will talk about what happened when judge merchan eviscerated them at that hearing. don't go anywhere. don't go anywhere.

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day 14 of trump's 2016 interference election trial. here with ms. lisa rubin and harry litman. you were talking at the end of the day there was a hearing. the jury leaves in the judge dressdown trump's lawyers who were petitioning for a mistrial based on stormy daniels testimony. >> 100%. first, they gave their spiel and the da basically said he is not telling the truth. it was as if judge merchan had written an order and memorized it and had it in his head. he told blanche on the cake dish gag order. i can't trust you because of the track record. we are not changing the gag order. when they came to the mistrial, he eviscerated the technique. he said you did not object here. then, you went and on your

cross, you went over this at length. the thing is, you are the one that put this in play because you started out with accusing her of lying in your opening. you did not talk about the records. these messy details, they are what go to motive and you have put his motive at issue by denying the whole thing. trump, who has forced them into this position, made them untenable and he ripped them. >> they are saying these details are prejudicial and we should have a mistrial. his responses, and i think we talked about this. blanche gets up and appears to deny that any of this happened. that they met. judge merchan said your denial and opening arguments makes all of this relevant. >> she needs the details to establish your credibility. >> blanche kept trying to say

this is not the story she told ami or michael cohen. and the prosecutor made quick work by saying she never talk to ami or to cohen. in terms of details, the person that knows whether they're true or not is your client. >> exactly. he is the one who has the motive to pay the hush money. >> the messy details are themselves proof of his motive. >> also said this which was interesting. this is from the da, there are other details that i do not want to put on the record. i'm happy to make a sealed record about the salacious details that were deliberately omitted. notwithstanding the fact that they are highly corroborative because we did not have the desire to embarrass the defendant. >> can i say it on tv? i never felt a 60-year-old before and that was gross. that was something they said. they sat on the sex stuff, we had six questions and these details were about the two or

three hours. >> he cited that is one of the examples. one thing we could've called out was stormy daniels was 27 and did not know what a 60-year- old man's skin felt like. we could've elicited that. >> we did not want to say -- nevertheless, it came in. >> time marches on for all of us. the other thing that happened today, there were a bunch of things, but i want to move to matalin. maybe you can set up who she was. >> trump's executive assistant in the white house. she worked for the rnc prior to his election then she became his roanoke rapids the white house. she was fired in 2019 because she was invited to what she thought was an off the record dinner with reporters. she allegedly had something to drink and she wasn't discreet by her own admission. she spilled something about the trump daughters and their relationship with her daughter. it was at that point she was

let go. that came out today and she was the second former trump white house aide to cry on the stand about how apologetic she was. even more than hope hicks, holds this man and very high esteem. she was devastated by the breakup with him and still is. >> she says spoke highly of him huge respect. he listened to my feedback. she really speaks highly of donald trump. i was struck by that. you do not get a ton of people -- >> no. >> that mistake cost me my job. i feel i've learned from experience and i've grown a lot . she starts crying. why was she there? what was she there to testify? >> she was there to stitch up the fedex checks and the back- and-forth. >> the president writing the checks from the white house inch her being the person --

>> i thought it was effective for him. other people disagreed. i think they would've called her. that would've been the risk if the da hadn't. maybe it was to take the sting out. it was an interesting moment. this book, i think everyone will wonder, how did she talk out of school? if that comes in because something she laid it on thick about, she wrote a book of contrition and confession. it came out that what she had said to reporters, she really said, i've got a better relationship with the daughters than he does. she was snarky about it. we don't know why she was fired. it was a pretty big deal. if it comes out, then the jurors i think will have retrospectively different picture of her. >> there was one good thing and

they got out of her. the checks, when they were sent, they were not sent directly to her in the white house. they were sent to keith and john at their personal residence is. susan necheles try to get out, they did that to circumvent the white house mail system. that doesn't hold up and she would not agree with that either. >> she laid it on thick about their great relationship, millennia's and her. that gives them -- and closing. >> for the defense? >> yeah. >> we will pick up with her tomorrow. we do not think michael cohen will be tomorrow? >> i don't think so but we have other custodial witnesses to hear from including once i could authenticate videotape that might come in. trip's -- was damaging against him. we have seeing that and tweets are and video, could there be more? >> the admission that he reimbursed michael cohen went in quickly through stormy that

we have been talking about for weeks in the civil suit. he confessed to it and now that's an evidence. >> as always, see you again soon. still ahead. vp outside the criminal courthouse where one senator is helping trump get around his gag order. that story, next. at story, nex flight. cirkul is the energy that gets you to the next level. cirkul is what you hope for when life tosses lemons your way. cirkul, available at walmart and drinkcirkul.com.

across all of donald trump's cases and trials, we've seen him get away with behavior no other defendant could. we watched judges tried to rein him in including gag order's. the one currently, and his near criminal case. over and over, trump walks up to and crosses the line. in his current criminal trial, judge merchan has held trump in contempt for violating the gag order 10 times. earlier, threaten the former president with jail time. so far, none seems to have deterred him from continuing. trump is a parallel strategy. imagine having your own united states senator, a man so embarrassingly obsequious, his willing to travel to new york missing a vote to come to a criminal trial and humiliate himself outside in the street in public. like a sad ventriloquist puppet to in the whining that trump is

legally barred from doing. i give you florida man rick scott, and actual united states senator. >> the lead prosecutor is the number 3 person that i -- biden justice department. the judgment ski daughter is a political operative. raises money for democrats. you've got the lead prosecutor's wife, significant donor to democrats and to biden. it's a bunch of democrats saying , we want to make sure that donald trump cannot talk. >> that seems a good rule you cannot have a wife or daughter doing anything to prosecute a case. protect democracy previously served as republican communications director on capitol hill and she joins me now. i have never had the highest opinion of rick scott. a man who oversaw a hospital chain that paid the largest fraud settlement in the history of medicaid, medicare, if i'm

not mistaken. i was surprised when the notice was put out yesterday he was going to do this. were you? >> gluck, the gag order that was issued to trump to protect the court proceedings strictly forbids trump from directing other people to make statements that he cannot. if rick scott did that, it's a direct violation of the order. that's and if, the judge should be monitoring that. what i think is completely evident is rick scott is following trump's public direction. we have seen trump publicly attacked judges, their family members as a routine matter of business throughout these court proceedings. and another political operations. it's a routine that is former white house counsel, ty cobb, gave an interview at political saying when he attacks family members, it's a, quote, strategic act of intimidation designed to run his traditional

approach of delegitimizing proceedings. that's a lawyer who knows how trump operates who is sing, this is how we does it. all rick scott or anybody else who wants to be in trump in favor of has to do is this is what trump is like. these are previous attacks that trump's has made. putting that aside, what we can also see is this is once again a raw display political power. i would not be surprised if more trump surrogates do not do similar things like this. it's interesting that rick scott is the first one to pioneer this process, noting he also has experience with fraud. i think it's worth noting that ken paxton, the texas attorney general, who has also been charged with fraud in the past made appearance recently too. you kind of have all these people coalescing around it. we saw throughout the last few years how trump is used the republican party as a shield from political accountability. what you are seeing now, and

you will continue to see through 2024, is how he uses the party as a shield from criminal accountability. that's what trump hopes to gain from this. >> i want to stay on your point. i want to hammer it home. something that happened in the civil fraud trial is a law clerk became the target of donald trump and his attorneys and trump's posts in that law clerk, who is anonymous public servant working in the courtroom, was getting 50 calls a day according to a court filing. she was getting harassed and had a security situation. her life was turned upside -- upside down. now you have trump officially part and a u.s. senator is coming up to -- from d.c. to new york explicitly to do his dirty work. he is sitting with the judge and goes after the family members, the daughter of the judge who has nothing to do with the case, the wife of one of the attorneys, nothing to do

with the case, so as to be a vector for the same harassment, bullying, and intimidation for donald trump. >> this is clearly the trump playbook. we saw how trump did this to his primary opponents in 2016. he went after jeb bush's wife and other people's wives. this is what he does. if you are trying to get into the vp stakes and increase your standing in trubisky republican party, you mimic what he does and his tactics and he will like you. >> it is notable, going after family members, it's notable to me and struck me today, rick scott is there at trump's command. donald trump's wife is not there. none of his children are there. no family members are there. this is a 77-year-old man who was facing a criminal trial for originating an affair he had while his current wife was nursing their 4-month-old son. at -- in the later years of his

life, there is no family member to come stick up for him, stand next to him, to be in the courtroom with him. they are not there. there is a senior -- u.s. senator who wants to be vp. amanda carpenter, thank you. still to come, president biden's campaign to make sure boaters know who is responsible for the criminalization of abortion across the country. tangible impact of the dobbs decision on millions of americans, next. americans, next.

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listen, if you want to know who is to blame for where we are right now, a finger can be directly pointed at the former president. the former president made it very clear and then did what he intended to do. he would pick three members of the united states supreme court with the intention they would undo the protections of roe v. wade. they did exactly as he intended. >> joe biden and kamala harris are putting abortion rights and the man responsible for overturning up front and center. reproductive rights were central issue and provide one of the clearest distinction between the two candidates. it's a subject of the latest episode of my podcast why is this happening in a special series were calling with pod 2024, the stakes.

we compare the presidential records, what they do, joe biden and donald trump on specific issues as two and commons phase of for the first time since 1892. this episode i talked to jessica who is frequently on this program. author of the fantastic newsletter abortion every day. we discuss the state of the post susan necheles were the donald trump and is court created that we now have to live in. >> there is a lot of chaos and a lot of suffering. suffering we are seeing a lot of people denying it. care, even when substance of lead they are supposed to get it. fire republican exceptions which we know are not real. with the chaos, it's a lot of fear among doctors, doctors leaving states, hospitals shutting down maternity wards which increases mortality deserts which in turn increase in maternal death rate. it is having this huge impact be on just individual people,

not being able to get the care they need. there has been this tremendous domino effect across all areas of american life, honestly. >> that whole episode is available now if you scan the qr code or search for chris hayes wherever you get -- the biden campaign rightly sees an advantage of reproductive rights among all voters and not just women of reproductive age. there launching a new abortion focused ad campaign aimed at latino men. here to talk about that and more in one of the top latino democratic political consultants of the past several decades and he happens to be my good friend. he joins me, next. e, next.

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i was born and raised in derek city in the bronx and when i went to high school in manhattan, one of my best friends in theater was a kid from the neighborhood in northern manhattan. in this home video over school theater group, he is holding the camera. on that day, our faculty adviser propose that my friend write a musical, for our theater group

for the stage. you can hear that moment at the end of the tape. pay close attention and the kid in the blue shirt is me. >> you were in. >> yes. >> fine. 90. okay, you are on. >> okay, you are on. the one behind the camera was lin manuel miranda who wrote a musical is directed and alerts for the award-winning musical hamilton. i spent a lot of time with him and i got to know his family well including his dad luis miranda who's a legendary democratic strategist in york city. he's had a fascinating career including working in the administrations of multiple new york city mayors and the presented campaign for hillary clinton and chuck schumer. he is still working to increase

latino representation in politics. >> you want to continue to be leader? make sure you accept and you vote for the people who you represent. >> joining me now is veteran democratic strategist luis miranda. his book is relentless. it is great to have you here. >> thank you for having me. >> you were talking about coming from puerto rico to the u.s. when you were 20, to study. one that has driven me crazy by the current national discussion of immigration is its focused on the border and focused on this problem. these people are coming here and it's a problem. the notion that lots of people come here and they bring with them amazing stuff, and having a country people want to come to his a good problem to have.

reading about your ingenuity and drive of coming here, i was reminded how much that is dropped out of the conversation. >> imagine, there would be no hamilton. campaigns i was part of. my wife is an amazing clinical psychologist that worked very hard. our stories are not unique. that's what i talk about in relentless. we are a typical latino family. many other latino families work hard and all they do is making sure their kids are doing better than them. that's why we came. >> it's interesting because the puerto rican experience is distinct. you do not face the obstacles of the immigration system because of the fact puerto rico was part of the u.s.. it's similar and different in many ways in the immigrant experience.

>> it is because we do not have the paper shuffling. which is a huge deterrent. we have a similar experience. i remember, and i talk about it in the book, my first six months here i went to the post office. that's the way i communicated with everyone in puerto rico, to drop some letters, and the guy sees my name and says miranda? i say yes. but you are not one of my miranda's? yvonne no, it did not matter. the experience is similar to that of many immigrants who were coming into the country. >> that extends to something you write and a lot of your work. you worked in new york city politics. it's the most sort of ethnic and neighborhood by neighborhood, and it's a very

cosmopolitan place. people have their turf. they have their people. in some ways, negotiating difference is what all new york city politics is about. what have you learned from that? >> i learned that first you are trying to figure out, who is in the neighborhood? my haber -- my neighborhood washington heights has changed over the last 42 years. that we have been there as a family. who are the people who move people in that neighborhood? when you are in local politics, you learn you have to hire so and so because he has 10 guys, 10 gals, that you need to knock on doors and for people to open the doors. >> it's not your running a campus operation. >> correct.

i hear a lot of what happens now, and it's great, you need to count how many doors you not, but it's better if you are knocking those doors with people who know who the knockers are. that is what you learn in new york city politics. for me, i talk about it in relentless, it is also the way i put together the hispanic federation. hispanic now latinx, it was not a common thing. we were puerto ricans in york. cubans in florida. mexicans in the southeast. all of a sudden, we realized, people want to call us latino's? that means i am not 1 million puerto rican are 1 million cubans. 50 millions mexican. now we are 70 million and now i

will negotiate. >> it can be a double-edged sword. then the question becomes hispanic voter latino vote. it's an enormous population of people whose experience, it runs the gamut, as any group of people but when talking about people who came under different conditions. puerto ricans are americans. do you think national politics also into the trap, particularly the democratic side, the latino vote, let's talk about immigration, for instance. for latinos, the stuff other voters -- >> no doubt. the issue is that we come into the political equation, latinos, after decades of looking at minorities as blacks and whites.

all of a sudden -- >> conflict in politics. >> blacks are base voters and we are losing some pieces of the white working class. we work with them. all of a sudden comes this huge voting block. now 62 million people in the united states that have venezuelans who just migrated from a socialist country they were leaving. third generation cubans who still have the lingering feeling of fidel castro, that their grandparents brought with them. puerto ricans from orlando are not the puerto ricans second and third generation of my family. born and raised in new york. i campaign heavily for young woman in texas who is running against criminal ken paxton.

she was a democratic candidate for ag. fifth-generation mexican american. we've got to take all of that into consideration, and the great thing about new york city and where i learned politics is all politics are local even though we are playing in the national scene. all politics are local. >> the book is called relentless and available now. it is great to see you. i hope i see you again soon. that does it for all in. alex wagner tonight starts right now. >> i love the spirited conversation. >> i love him. he's a great guy. guy. this. today we got the news the prosecution in donald trump's new york hush money case does not plan to call karen mcdougal to testify. if you remember karen mcdougal is the